99 Kommentare

• Claudia

  Von Herzen Dank für die wichtige Denkhilfe und Informationen. Wissenschaft und engagiertes Menschsein gehen bei Ihnen so stimmig und kraftvoll in Eins. Das inspiriert mich und supportet mein gesellschaftliches Ich. Wie wichtig wäre es, wenn diese Botschaften breiter Gehör finden würden…
• Mirjam

  Neben den vielen interessanten Aspekten dieses Interviews, hat mich doch sehr gestört, dass die darin geforderte Differenzierung nicht beachtet wurde. Um die Geschichte richtig zu verstehen, muß klar sein, dass nicht Juden ein fremdes Land kolonialisiert haben, wie jetzt immer wieder behauptet wird und durch die sehr verkürzte Darstellung im Interview so verstanden werden kann. Das Land wurde den Juden von der UN übergeben – und auch nur bestimmte Gebiete. Da die Palästinenser mit der Teilung (Zweistaatenlösung) nicht einverstanden waren, haben sie mit den Nachbarländern gegen Israel Krieg geführt. Die Vertreibung war eine Folge des von ihnen verlorenen Krieges und kein aggressiver Akt der Israelis, wie von Egbert dargestellt. Nach der Staatsgründung wurden dann ca. 850 000 Juden aus muslimischen Staaten vertrieben, wo sie ihre jahrtausendalte Heimat und die größten Teile ihres Besitzes verloren. Nebenbei gesagt, wurden aus einigen dieser Länder auch die dort verfolgten Christen vertrieben – auch darüber wird kaum gesprochen. Durch diese Einseitigkeit der Darstellung kommt es zu einer Täter-Opfer-Umkehr und in der Folge zur Aneignung und Unterstützung von terroristischer Propaganda. Sehr empfehlenswert zu diesem Thema ein Artikel der Bundeszentrale für politische Bildung: https://www.bpb.de/themen/antisemitismus/dossier-antisemitismus/321671/flucht-und-vertreibung-von-juden-aus-den-arabischen-laendern/. Verfolgung und Vertreibung gab es also nicht nur durch die Deutschen. Der Mufti von Jerusalem hat bei den Nazis gelernt. Insofern geht auch da unsere Geschichte weiter und auch unsere Verantwortung.
  Das ist mir sehr wichtig mit zu sehen, um der derzeitigen Hass- und Gewaltverherrlichung etwas entgegenzusetzen.
• Professor Dr. Aleida Assmann

  Vielen Dank für diese Darstellung und Belehrung!
  Ich möchte betonen, dass ich mich hier nur der Darstellung meiner israelischen Freunde anschliesse und versuche ihr Gehör zu verschaffen. Diese Freunde machen sich nämlich Gedanken darüber, wie ein Zusammenleben der beiden Nationen in Zukunft in diesem Territorium gelingen könnte. Darüber wird bei uns zu wenig gesprochen. Der Pfingstkongress bietet dafür eine Möglichkeit. Der Diskurs der Schuldzuweisung bringt niemanden in die Zukunft. Netanyahu sicher auch nicht. Ich kann hier nur das letzte Kapitel des Buches von Moshe Zimmermann, Niemals Frieden? empfehlen. (Es ist für den Leipziger Buchpreis vorgeschlagen). Da entwirft er eine Perspektive, wie in den Köpfen abgerüstet werden könnte. Dazu wollte auch ich mit dem Gespräch beitragen. Meine leitende Frage lautet : wie kann aus zwei entgegengesetzten ‘Wir’ ein Raum geschaffen werden für zwei miteinander verbundene ‘Wir’?
• Professor Dr. Aleida Assmann

  Zur Ergänzung:
  Am 12. Mai hat auch in diesem Jahr der alternative israelisch-palästinensische Gedenktag für alle Opfer des Krieges stattgefunden, immer mehr Zulauf hat. Das gemeinsame Trauern soll Verständnis schaffen und Umkehr ermöglichen. Vielen öffnet die Zeremonie die Augen, um das Leid der Anderen anzuerkennen und ermutigt sie auf ihrem Weg zu Versöhnung und Frieden. Das Motto dieser Veranstaltung lautet: «Wir müssen die Wirklichkeit ändern, um eine bessere Zukunft für unsere Kinder zu schaffen!»
• Professor Dr. Aleida Assmann

  Vom Ich zum Wir – das kann auch für das Zusammentragen und die gemeinsame Verarbeitung von Informationen und Wissen gelten. Was Mirjam gepostet hat, ist wichtig, aber es ist vielleicht nur die Hälfte der Geschichte. Ich schlage eine etwas erweiterte Perspektive vor in dem Kurzvortrag, den ich letztes Jahr auf dem Kirchentag in Nürnberg gehalten habe (siehe Info und Link oben). Der Unabhängigkeitskrieg wurde durch die Gründungserklärung des Staates Israel am 14. Mai 1948 eingeleitet. Die arabischen Anreihnerstaaten versuchten das damals zu verhindern und griffen an. Aus diesem Krieg, der als Verteidigungskrieg begann, ging Israel siegreich hervor. Dieser Krieg, der auf der einen Seite als Staatsgründung Israels gefeiert wird, hat mit der Niederlage der Palästinenser die sogenannte “Nakba” eingeleitet. Während die 4. Generation der Vertriebenen heute in Flüchtlingslagern in Jordanien und Libanon lebt, setzt sich die Vertreibung bis heute im Westjordanland fort. Das Land hat sich sein Existenzrecht damals durch militärische (Über-)Macht erworben, und dieses Existenzrecht ist mit allen Mitteln zu schützen. Denn ohne militärische Macht geht es nicht, aber sie allein genügt offensichtlich nicht, um eine dauerhafte Koexistenz im Nahen Osten zu erreichen. Das hat der FAZ Korrespondent Christian Meier letztes Jahr in seinem Bericht über die Feierlichkeiten zum 75. Jubiläum prophetisch so ausgedrückt: „Es ist unwahrscheinlich, dass Israel weitere 75 Jahre in seiner derzeitigen Form erleben wird. Um zu entscheiden, welchen Weg es gehen wird, braucht das Land dringend eine neue Utopie“. Meine Aufgabe als Erinnerungsforscherin sehe ich darin, diese Utopie, die es auf beiden Seiten ja gibt, zu entwickeln und zu stärken. Den Schlüssel dafür sehe ich im Aufbau eines gemeinsamen Erinnerns und damit in der Überwindung eines ‚exklusiven Wir‘ zu einem ‚inklusiven Wir‘.
• Waltraud

  Ich möchte Danke sagen für dieses Interview und die nachfolgenden Ergänzungen. Ich schließe mich den Ausführungen von Frau Claudia an, sie treffen es für mich genau auf den Punkt.
  Bereichernd in der Klarheit und Professionalität.
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